Can't delete paragraph styles....

[martin-k]

From the Word screenshot you have shown, click on Options, then open the list "Select styles to show" and select "All styles" - now your sidebar looks like in TextMaker.

Really, you can avoid all this by keeping "Styles in use" selected.

[vtpoet]

From the Word screenshot you have shown, click on Options, then open the list "Select styles to show" and select "All styles" - now your sidebar looks like in TextMaker.

But that's the point. I don't want to see all styles. I only want to see the styles I'm actually using. Both WORD and LO allow me to do this. If I open a blank document, then both WORD and LO show a blank styles list. This is what SHOULD happen. Textmaker doesn't do this. Textmaker populates the Styles Window regardless of whether the styles are being used.

Really, you can avoid all this by keeping "Styles in use" selected.

No, that doesn't work, and that's my point. See the image below. A blank document. No styles are "In use", and yet Softmaker populates the Styles Window with styles, unlike Word or LO. Only *NORMAL* would be visible, *if* Softmaker worked like Word or LO.

Blank Document. Showing "Styles in Use"

[martin-k]

Now we are getting somewhere. The last screenshot you posted does not show at all the styles built into TextMaker. We don't have styles such as "Center (white space no italics)".

These styles exist in the document, there is no other possibility. Can you upload the template or document to verify?

[vtpoet]

I can do that.

And yes, those are my styles. Those aren't "Softmaker Styles".

However, if Textmaker behaved like Word or LO, the styles would nevertheless not be displayed if they weren't being used.

Maybe the problem is that Textmaker only hides its own styles?

[martin-k]

OK, confirmed. Your document is full of user-defined styles. Toggling to "All styles" only _adds_ even more styles.

I think the misunderstanding stems from the following:

TextMaker: "Styles in use" = show the styles physically defined in the document, "All styles" = add the "virtual" styles that are predefined by the MS Word standard.

LibreOffice: "Styles in use" = show only the styles that are used by some paragraph in the document.

We once considered such an option, but couldn't find a use case: You have an empty document full of styles. None of the styles are visible in the sidebar. Now how do you apply them? They are all hidden.

Please help me better understand how you are working with such a system.

[vtpoet]

Please help me better understand how you are working with such a system.

Gladly.

The primary reason I purchased Textmaker is twofold, I use Linux and I write ebooks. LO is about a decade behind in terms of its style management and, as you know, it's not as fluid with Word documents (often required by publishers). Textmaker also has a reliable epub converter.

Ebooks require all formatting to be defined by styles (soft-formatting) --- paragraph and character. That means I have to define a style for every non-standard facet of the ebook (such as poetry, centered text, indented, etc...). After a point, all those styles begin to add up --- even if I make a different template for every document.

The ability to hide the styles "not in use" means I wouldn't have to search through all my paragraph styles every time I needed to apply formatting. This issue is compounded by the fact that in Linux (unlike Textmaker in windows), I can't scroll through the styles using the mouse's scroll button.

The primary use-case, therefore, is in using Textmaker to write Ebooks, where the use of Styles is a requirement --- and often requires creating any number of non-standard styles.

[martin-k]

How do you access a style that is defined, but that you haven't yet used in your document?

[sven-l]

The ability to hide the styles "not in use" means I wouldn't have to search through all my paragraph styles every time I needed to apply formatting. This issue is compounded by the fact that in Linux (unlike Textmaker in windows), I can't scroll through the styles using the mouse's scroll button.

I will report the issue that it is not possible to scroll through the styles using the mouse's scroll button in TextMaker 2018 for Linux.

[vtpoet]

How do you access a style that is defined, but that you haven't yet used in your document?

Well... you know... usually that's not a problem because Textmaker, even if I've chosen to only show styles in use, still shows all of them. (Hence this email thread.)

But, all else being equal, I would either have assigned a keyboard shortcut or I would simply opt to "Show All Styles". When using Word or LO, I would usually start out by showing all styles then, once I'd gotten started (and had applied the styles most likely to be used), could safely switch to "styles in use" for the rest of the document.

Right now, for instance, I'm editing a collection of stories. I'm a third of the way in and really don't need to see all the other styles. The ones I'm most likely to use have already been applied.

[vtpoet]

I will report the issue that it is not possible to scroll through the styles using the mouse's scroll button in TextMaker 2018 for Linux.

Thanks, Sven.

[Jossi]

I think I'm beginning to see vtpoet's issue.

Basically there are three kinds of styles:

(1) Styles which are actually used in a document (i. e. applied to some portion of text) and (of course) stored in the document
(2) Styles which are stored in a document but not in actual use (i. e. not applied to some portion of text)
(3) Styles which are neither used nor stored in a document but available if needed (stored somewhere in the application files).

In TextMaker, "Styles in Use" shows (1) and (2), "All styles" shows (1), (2) and (3).
What vtpoet wants is an option to show only (1), and he expected (from his experience with LibreOffice) to find this in "Styles in use".
So in fact it's a feature request for an additional option.

(NB. If this option were to be introduced, names should be changed to avoid confusion, to something like "Styles used"/"Styles stored"/"All styles".)

[vtpoet]

Hmmm.... but why even differentiate between styles like this?

Does one really care or need to know if a style is an application style or a document style? And by document style, I assume you mean: "Styles which are stored in a document but not in actual use..." and I'm not even sure I know what you mean by that. If all the styles are a part of a template (as in mine), why is textmaker nonetheless distinguishing between "user styles" and "system styles"? I personally don't care. Styles are styles from my perspective.

That said, I suppose Textmaker could offer four different views:

1. System Styles (i.e. application styles)
2. Document(User?) Styles
3. System Styles and Document Styles
4. Applied Styles

But why?

As Jossi rightly says, I'd like see a list of "applied" styles (styles applied in the document) and nothing else. I suppose one could call that a feature request, but it isn't really. It's a request that the label do what it claims to do. Show "applied styles" and nothing else. The "applied styles" category looses it's meaning if it's listing dozens of styles that aren't actually applied. Just my 2 cents.

[Jossi]

And by document style, I assume you mean: "Styles which are stored in a document but not in actual use..." and I'm not even sure I know what you mean by that.

Well, "document style" is a label introduced by you, not by me. What I mean is: Go for example to Format > Paragraph style, click "New", give a name (let's say "Test"), define the style, then click "OK" and "Close". Now reopen Format > Paragraph style: The new style "Test" sits there in the "Styles in use" list, which means: It has been defined (by you), it exists, it is stored with the document and it will be visible in "Styles in use" whenever the document will be opened. But it is not yet actually applied to any part of the text. This can or must be done in a separate step.

If all the styles are a part of a template (as in mine), why is textmaker nonetheless distinguishing between "user styles" and "system styles"? I personally don't care.

Well, I for my part do. Let's say I usually work with three levels of headings in my documents. I have defined these as paragraph styles in my document template. When I begin a new document based on this template, at first there is no text at all, so no paragraph style is actually in use. But I want to be able to apply the correct style to every heading as I write it, so all my heading styles must sit in the sidebar. What I don't want to see there, though, is an endless list of all the predefined styles TextMaker makes available, but only the styles I have defined myself.

That said, I suppose Textmaker could offer four different views:

1. System Styles (i.e. application styles)
2. Document(User?) Styles
3. System Styles and Document Styles
4. Applied Styles

This adds a fourth option. Using the definitions listed in my previous posting, your 1. shows (3), 2. shows (1) and (2), 3. shows (1), (2) and (3), 4. shows (1). So your 2. would be equivalent to the present "Styles in use", your 3. would be equivalent to the present "All styles" and your 1. and 4. would be additional options.

But why?

As for 4., this is what you are wishing for all the time. As for 2., see above. As for 1. and 3., obviously there must be some option to show the predefined styles. I think 3. would be sufficient – no need for 1., but this was introduced by you.

As Jossi rightly says, I'd like see a list of "applied" styles (styles applied in the document) and nothing else. I suppose one could call that a feature request, but it isn't really. It's a request that the label do what it claims to do. Show "applied styles" and nothing else. The "applied styles" category looses it's meaning if it's listing dozens of styles that aren't actually applied. Just my 2 cents.

I admit the label "Styles in Use" is slightly misleading as it can easily be understood as meaning "Applied styles" (which it doesn't mean). There seems to be a need for both, "Applied styles" and "User defined styles (applied or not)", so it boils down to introducing an additional option, which is a feature request.

[vtpoet]

Well, I for my part do....What I don't want to see... is an endless list of all the predefined styles TextMaker makes available, but only the styles I have defined myself.

Fair enough. I can see how that would be useful.

I think 3. would be sufficient – no need for 1., but this was introduced by you.

I don't either, but I'm guessing someone will come along with a use case.

There seems to be a need for both, "Applied styles" and "User defined styles (applied or not)", so it boils down to introducing an additional option, which is a feature request.

As long as that doesn't mean the feature won't show up until 2020 or 2021—though I suppose debating semantics isn't going to change that.

As it stands, knowing what I know (thanks to your explanation), I think there are a number of Styles I no longer use that I could weed out. Will try that approach. Thanks for all your help.