Bug: Bold does not work unless it is defined in the font.

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julian
Posts: 148
Joined: Sat Jun 14, 2014 11:25 am
Location: Northamptonshire, United Kingdom

Bug: Bold does not work unless it is defined in the font.

Postby julian » Thu Jan 08, 2015 10:50 am

Hi.

 When the Bold character attribute is assigned to some text, the text is correctly marked as Bold. But, if the font in use does not have a Bold Font-file, then the text is not shown as Bold, nor is it Printed as Bold.

 However, The Italic attribute works correctly, in that if the font does not have an Italic Font-file TextMaker still displays and print Italic text. Even Bold+Italic only shows Italic text.

 All other full function Word-Processors I have used, automatically create the: Italic, Bold, and Italic+Bold characters if these have not been explicitly defined in the Font-file; the PC version of TextMaker works this way.

 Please address these bug quickly as it stops me using may favourite font “Andika”; a SIL font.

I have attached one of the font to help in reproducing this bug.

Regards Julian.
Attachments
sminfo.txt
Your system Info file.
(23.54 KiB) Downloaded 71 times
Andika-R.txt
A font for which TextMaker exhibits the problem.
Please change the .TXT extension to .TTF
(1.33 MiB) Downloaded 95 times

sven-l
SoftMaker Team
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Re: Bug: Bold does not work unless it is defined in the font

Postby sven-l » Mon Jan 12, 2015 1:53 pm

If you have no bold font file, TextMaker cannot show bold for that font (only a fake italic without the italic font file). The other word processors seem to fake the bold.
Sven Leßmann
SoftMaker Software GmbH

julian
Posts: 148
Joined: Sat Jun 14, 2014 11:25 am
Location: Northamptonshire, United Kingdom

Re: Bug: Bold does not work unless it is defined in the font.

Postby julian » Wed Jan 14, 2015 9:41 pm

Hi Sven,

 Agreed, but Fake Bold is better than No Bold. TextMaker HD does produce Fake Italic. I have created a Bold font definition for the SIL font I sent you, and TextMaker can then produce Bold+FakeItalic text.

 All professional fonts will have a Regular, Bold, Italic, Bold+Italic definitions. But many other fonts will only have the Regular defined, leaving it up to the word processor to provide the other attributes.

 Out of interest, a font definition can also be created for Outline, Shadow, Negative, Condensed, and Extended. And a font definition can also hold the metrics for Subscript, Superscript, Strikeout, Underline; and of cause: Bold &/or Italics. And if these have not been set, the word processor is required to produce Fake versions of them.

 In my estimation this bug/flaw is a show-stopper. if, while I was selecting a word processor to buy, I had found that Bold was only available if the font definition had been explicated created for it, I would have rejected TextMaker without a seconds thought.

 It also cuts away at Softmaker’s claim that TextMaker can edit Microsoft Word documents. Because if the document uses a font without a Bold definition the document will not look or print the same. All that can be said is that TextMaker can reliably edit Microsoft Word that use professional fonts, which is a very weak statement.

 It is also true that the all competent word processor I have trialled, will produce Fake Bold, when needed. Indeed the only two word processors I have ever found that do not produce Fake Bold are TextMaker for Android HD and TextMaker for Android phones.

Note: TextMaker for PC does produce Fake Bold.

Regards Julian

PS If this is not to be fixed I will have to, reluctantly, stop using TextMaker for Android HD and start using WPS. No Bold means No use.

sven-l
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Re: Bug: Bold does not work unless it is defined in the font.

Postby sven-l » Thu Jan 15, 2015 8:15 am

Ok, I will refer this as a suggestion for an improvement to our developers. Thank you!
Sven Leßmann
SoftMaker Software GmbH

Jossi
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Re: Bug: Bold does not work unless it is defined in the font.

Postby Jossi » Thu Jan 15, 2015 11:47 am

From a typographical or design point of view, fake bold and fake oblique (this is not italic) are simply abominations and to be avoided at any price.

julian
Posts: 148
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Location: Northamptonshire, United Kingdom

Re: Bug: Bold does not work unless it is defined in the font.

Postby julian » Sun May 24, 2015 8:38 pm

Hello,

I think you have a great product with TextMaker HD for Android. But it has one major floor. It cannot display Bold text. It sets the text to Bold but it does not display it emboldened. This is unheard of in a WYSIWYG word processor. Every application I have used, and in more than 30 years in IT I have used many, all of them have been able to display emboldened text. Well that's not quite true, your TextMaker Free for Android also has this problem. But your desktop office application does not; the PC version displays Bold text correctly.

The problem seems to be related to the font in use. The two most commonly used fonts used are Ariel and Times New Roman; both of which no not display Bold text correctly. I am using two Samsung devices: a Galaxy Tab 3 and a Galaxy S 3 mini. Both have the Courier New and Courier-PS fonts. Both devices display Courier-PS correctly, i.e. Bold is shown emboldened. But both devices display Courier New incorrectly; No Bold; Bold text is not shown emboldened. If a block of text is using Courier-PS and some text is emboldened, the text is displayed correctly. If that same text is changed to Courier-New the emboldening disappears. But if the text is reverted back to Courier-PS, the emboldened text is again displayed correctly. Proving that TextMaker has marked the text for Bold but does not always display it correctly.

It also seems to be related to whether or not the font has an emboldened font installed. But I do not know Android well enough to check that for shore. But if I copy the bold fonts for Ariel and Times New Roman from my PC to my Samsungs, Bold text is then displayed correctly for Ariel and Times New Roman.

For an application to say it is compatible with Microsoft Word it must be able to display Bold text whether or not a Bold font is installed.

I have noted this failure before, but was told to display Bold text it could only be a fake Bold. But better a fake Bold than no Bold. And TextMaker does display Italic text correctly, even if there is no Italic font is installed. So TextMaker displays 'Fake' Italic, there seems no good reason not to display 'fake' Bold.

The reason for not displaying Bold text is because most font designers do not create a Bold version of they font. They leave it to the word possessor to produce the Bold text.

Please address this soon. It will put people off as soon as they are unable to use Bold text; particularly in the most commonly used font: Ariel and Times New Roman.

I did, some years ago, discover this fault in the free TextMaker for Android, and so rejected it as my Android Word Processor. It was the full function Android HD version that got me looking again. Please fix this soon. You have a great product, which is let down greatly by this very fixable problem. You know how to fix it in your PC version, surly it would be possible to transfer the algorithm to Android even if it needs to be recoded.

Regards Julian.

PS: Abominations or not, If MS Word can display it then any compatible Word Processor must also be able to display it as well! Or it cannot claim to be compatible!

Alfred
Posts: 127
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Location: Scotland

Re: Bug: Bold does not work unless it is defined in the font.

Postby Alfred » Sun Jul 26, 2015 5:36 pm

julian wrote:most font designers do not create a Bold version of [their] font

I don't know where you get that idea, Julian. Times New Roman and Arial (not to be confused with Ariel, which is Disney's 'Little Mermaid' or a brand of washing powder!) most certainly do include a Bold style (along with Italic and Bold Italic); I think it's quite rare for professional font designers to create only a Regular style unless the font is intended purely for casual use. As Jossi says, oblique (which is all you get with a faux font) is not the same as italic.

julian
Posts: 148
Joined: Sat Jun 14, 2014 11:25 am
Location: Northamptonshire, United Kingdom

Re: Bug: Bold does not work unless it is defined in the font.

Postby julian » Thu Jul 30, 2015 1:22 pm

Hi Alfred,

   I agree that many professional fonts will create the Bold, Italic, and Bold Italic. But if this is not the case, the application needs to do the work. Even MS Notepad get this right.

   A quick look through my fonts reveals many common fonts by many typography foundries do not always produce Bold, Italic, and Bold Italic forms. [In one case I only have the Italic form].

   But whatever the in's and out's, the fact remains that if an MS Word document is opened in TextMaker on Android: and the Bold, Italic, and Bold Italic is not preserved, TextMaker on Android cannot legitimately claim to be MS Word compatible. Particularly as TextMaker for Windows does get this right and produces a Bold, Italic, or Bold Italic forms when the form does not exist as a font.

   I am at a lose to understand why I am being told this is not an issue. When it comes to Bold, Italic, or Bold Italic, fake is better than none. And whether Oblique is the same as Italic, most writers of business or personal documents do not care; all they wish to see is Embolden when they have selected Bold, and Italicised when they have selected Italic, and both when they have selected both.

   Any of the fonts listed below could well be used in the Bold, Italic, &/or Bold Italic form. And even the Symbol fonts could well be used in their Bold, Italic, &/or Bold Italic forms. I have marked the most unexpected fonts with an asterisk '*'

Andika Regular ___________________ SIL International
Arial Unicode MS Regular * _________ Agfa Monotype Corporation
Cambria Math Regular * ___________ Microsoft Corporation
Century Regular __________________ Agfa Monotype Corporation
Courier Regular * _________________ (C) Microsoft
Fixedsys Regular _________________ Bitstream Inc
French Script MT Regular * ________ The Monotype Corporation
Gabriola Regular _________________ Microsoft Corporation
Impact Regular __________________ Monotype Typography Inc
Javenese Text Regular ____________ Tiro Typeworks Ltd, for Microsoft Corporation
Microsoft Sans Serif Regular * ______ Microsoft Corporation
Monotype Corsiva italic ____________ Monotyoe Typegraphy Inc
MS Reference Sans Serif Regular * ___ Microsoft Corp.
MS Reference Speciality Regular ____ Monotype Typography
MS Sans Serif Regular _____________ (C) Microsoft Corp.
MS Serif Regular _________________ (C) Microsoft Corp.
Roman Regular __________________ (C) Microsoft 1985
Script Regular ___________________ (C) Microsoft 1985
Segoe UI Emoji Regular ___________ Microsoft Corporation
Segoe UI Symbol Regular __________ Microsoft Corporation
Small Fonts Regular _____________ (C) Microsoft Corp. 1987
Symbol Regular * ________________ Monotype Typography
System Bold ____________________ (C) Microsoft Corp. 1988-1989
Tempus Sans ITC Regular _________ International Typeface Corporation
Webdings ______________________ Microsoft Corporation
Wingdings Regular _______________ Microsoft Typography
Wingdings 2 Regular _____________ It is very common to embolden this font
Wingdings 3 Regular _____________ It is very common to embolden this font

   I can well understand why Microsoft would not create a Bold form of Arial Unicode MS Regular, it consists of 50,377 glyphs. Anyone of which a writer may wish to embolden. But in the Android version of TextMaker they cannot. To me this issue should be taken a little more seriously.

Regards Julian

PS I purchased TextMaker HD for Android, but as I write for learners with special needs I use fonts more suited to their needs. I have stopped using TextMaker HD for Android as I cannot be sure I can embolden my text. As soon as this is fixed I will return to TextMaker HD for Android.

Before TextMaker HD for Android existed, I assessed TextMaker for Android, but because the Bold feature did not work, I was concerned that other features would not work, so I would not commit my time to learning it. I am very surprised and disappointed this has taken so long. I first raised it in Jan 2015, a full seven months ago.

Alfred
Posts: 127
Joined: Sat Jun 14, 2014 3:40 pm
Location: Scotland

Re: Bug: Bold does not work unless it is defined in the font.

Postby Alfred » Sat Aug 01, 2015 12:47 pm

julian wrote:Any of the fonts listed below could well be used in the Bold, Italic, &/or Bold Italic form. And even the Symbol fonts could well be used in their Bold, Italic, &/or Bold Italic forms. I have marked the most unexpected fonts with an asterisk '*'
That's a pretty impressive list, Julian! :-o


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